Author Topic: Vista Startup problems  (Read 60916 times)

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Offline Xas1953NC

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Vista Startup problems
« on: January 27, 2015, 02:11:46 pm »
Hello Shane, I had made notes on the various sequences I have used in starting up Vista. These include stopwatched stages. I also have repair log results, cbs.log results, chkdsk.log results and performance event logs of what happens in starting and closing down Vista. Rather than display them here and therefore taking up screen space would you rather I zipped them under one folder for you to look at and then you could then decide what to show if need be? Thanks.

Offline Shane

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #1 on: January 28, 2015, 12:11:59 am »
You can zip them up and attach them, there is a 4 mb size limit per file, so if they are big you might want to zip them up into multiple files.

What exactly is going on that you want me to check on?

Shane

Offline Xas1953NC

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #2 on: January 28, 2015, 01:12:02 am »
Hello Shane, you previously said it could be a dying hdd and I thought if I sent you the data from the software side you may be able to pin down the cause. The thing is that once the computer startup is successful further restarts and power down and power up again actions do so without a hitch unless the computer is turned off and an amount of time has passed. Then the problem starts over again. Leaving the computer on for 48 hours or so has no detrimental affect during the run. Last night I downloaded your test file which you developed regarding another user's cbs.log issues. I ran it and all packages came up with no corruptions. I'll start to compile the data I have and send it zipped. Thanks.

Offline Shane

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #3 on: January 28, 2015, 01:13:54 am »
Have you used a tool to look at the smart status of the hard drive and see what it reports?

Shane

Offline Xas1953NC

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #4 on: January 28, 2015, 01:19:09 am »
You mean a profile tool such as Speccy?

Offline Shane

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #5 on: January 28, 2015, 01:20:45 am »
If it pulls the smart status then yes, otherwise if the drive is a seagate or western digital, they have tools for free that can read the smart status of the drive.

Shane

Offline Xas1953NC

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #6 on: January 28, 2015, 01:39:15 am »
Have just pulled down latest version of Speccy. It shows C Drive as status good and temp 35c as good. I have an attached self powered usb drive which show temp as bad at 59c. On one of the tests I removed all ext drives and the printer prior to the first initial startup of the day and the computer exhibited the same problems as when all peripherals were connected.

Offline Xas1953NC

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #7 on: January 28, 2015, 01:42:35 am »
One of the repair logs states
 Root cause found: Unspecified changes to system configuration might have caused the problem.

Offline Shane

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #8 on: January 28, 2015, 06:06:42 am »
Yeah but the smart data off of a drive will show what its internal stats say, including spin up times, bad sectors and any other problems.

What hard drive do you have?

Shane

Offline Xas1953NC

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #9 on: January 28, 2015, 07:47:59 am »
Do not have a program to show spinup times. These are the C, D,S  Drives in tower. Data from Speccy profiler.

Storage
      Hard drives
            WDC WD6400AAKS-22A7B0 ATA Device
               Manufacturer   Western Digital
               Form Factor   GB/3.5-inch
               Business Unit/Brand   Desktop/WD Caviar
               Heads   16
               Cylinders   77,825
               Tracks   19,845,375
               Sectors   1,250,258,625
               SATA type   SATA-II 3.0Gb/s
               Device type   Fixed
               ATA Standard   ATA8-ACS
               Serial Number   WD-WCASY0719613
               Firmware Version Number   01.03B01
               LBA Size   48-bit LBA
               Power On Count   1890 times
               Power On Time   850.0 days
               Features   S.M.A.R.T., AAM, NCQ
               Max. Transfer Mode   SATA II 3.0Gb/s
               Used Transfer Mode   SATA II 3.0Gb/s
               Interface   SATA
               Capacity   596 GB
               Real size   640,135,028,736 bytes
               RAID Type   None
                  S.M.A.R.T
                     Status   Good
                     Temperature   40 °C
                     Temperature Range   OK (less than 50 °C)
                        S.M.A.R.T attributes
                  Partition 0
                     Partition ID   Disk #0, Partition #0
                     File System   NTFS
                     Volume Serial Number   F4DE1251
                     Size   14.7 GB
                     Used Space   8.13 GB (55%)
                     Free Space   6.52 GB (45%)
                  Partition 1
                     Partition ID   Disk #0, Partition #1
                     Disk Letter   C:
                     File System   NTFS
                     Volume Serial Number   5245E47C
                     Size   232 GB
                     Used Space   130 GB (56%)
                     Free Space   102 GB (44%)
                  Partition 2
                     Partition ID   Disk #0, Partition #2
                     Disk Letter   S:
                     File System   NTFS
                     Volume Serial Number   A2DB42E6
                     Size   348 GB
                     Used Space   304 GB (87%)
                     Free Space   44 GB (13%)
            WDC WD6400AAKS-22A7B0 ATA Device
               Manufacturer   Western Digital
               Form Factor   GB/3.5-inch
               Business Unit/Brand   Desktop/WD Caviar
               Heads   16
               Cylinders   77,825
               Tracks   19,845,375
               Sectors   1,250,258,625
               SATA type   SATA-II 3.0Gb/s
               Device type   Fixed
               ATA Standard   ATA8-ACS
               Serial Number   WD-WCASY1594132
               Firmware Version Number   01.03B01
               LBA Size   48-bit LBA
               Power On Count   1892 times
               Power On Time   852.5 days
               Features   S.M.A.R.T., AAM, NCQ
               Max. Transfer Mode   SATA II 3.0Gb/s
               Used Transfer Mode   SATA II 3.0Gb/s
               Interface   SATA
               Capacity   596 GB
               Real size   640,135,028,736 bytes
               RAID Type   None
                  S.M.A.R.T
                     Status   Good
                     Temperature   41 °C
                     Temperature Range   OK (less than 50 °C)
                        S.M.A.R.T attributes
                  Partition 0
                     Partition ID   Disk #1, Partition #0
                     Disk Letter   D:
                     File System   NTFS
                     Volume Serial Number   40ACF239
                     Size   596 GB
                     Used Space   66 GB (11%)
                     Free Space   529 GB (89%)
         

Offline Xas1953NC

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #10 on: January 28, 2015, 08:46:21 am »
As an aside, the external usb hdd, drive J Graphic drive, is one that shows red temp of 60c. Sometimes this drive will not be recognized or it will take 2 minutes or so for it to be recognised. Seagate Dashboard considers hdd as ok. In the past I have set the spin down time to 15 min when not being accessed but what happened is that even if I were not accessing the drive it's led would fluctuate and I would be unable to carry out particular actions as I was greeted with "not corresponding" messages. Things returned to normal when the fluctuating stopped. I assumed the fluctuating was due to the drive attempting to spin up and failing to do so right away as sometimes I had to wait about 10 minutes before it stabilised. I then set the spin down time to "Never" and that resolved the fluctuating. The downside could be the 60c red temp. The drive is only half full so has not intruded into the 20% area. I have now disconnected it and will connect to my wife's computer as she has room on her external usb hdd to copy across from the J drive. Quite a few years ago I problems starting up my previous XP computer and found it was a faulty mouse. As I said regarding the current problem, removing all peripherals and then starting up did not resolve the issue.

Offline Shane

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #11 on: January 28, 2015, 12:32:22 pm »
Post what western digitals tool shows
http://download.wdc.com/windlg/WinDlg_v1_28.zip?v=7990

Reason why I want to see the data is you said that the drive acts fine once it has been on for a bit and stays fine. It isnt until it has been off for a while that it seems to be very slow before getting back to speed. So I am curious if there is a hardware problem with the components inside, where when they are cold they are not spinning the platters are easily as they should. But once the components heat up then it gets to full speed.

Looking at the actual smart data might let me see if any numbers line up with something like that happening.

Shane

Offline Xas1953NC

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #12 on: January 28, 2015, 01:46:07 pm »
Thanks for the prog. I installed it and it showed a list of WD hdds. I did a quick test on the 2x640 gb ones but do not know if any files are made to send to you. I tried to use a scroll window screen grab prog but it was not capable of doing so.

Offline Xas1953NC

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #13 on: January 28, 2015, 01:49:31 pm »
Sorry Shane, I forgot to mention that they both had green ticks against them in the drive view list before and after the test

Offline Boggin

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #14 on: January 28, 2015, 03:38:48 pm »
This is what HDDScan3.3 gives for mine - would this be better for the info you want Shane ?

http://hddscan.com/

These all had green lights next to them and to copy & paste I just right clicked in a blank area to the right of the grid - clicked on Select all to highlight then pasted into the reply box - so no attachments to chew on with.

HDDScan S.M.A.R.T. Report
Model: TOSHIBA MK6465GSXN
Firmware: GH101M
Serial: 91RXT06ST
LBA: 1250263728

Report By: HDDScan for Windows version 3.3
Report Date: 28/01/2015 23:20:18


 Num  Attribute Name  Value  Worst  Raw(hex)  Threshold 

 001 Raw Read Error Rate  100 100 0000000000-0000 050

 002 Throughput performance  100 100 0000000000-0000 050

 003 Spin Up Time  100 100 0000000000-084A 001

 004 Start/Stop Count  100 100 0000000000-14DC 000

 005 Reallocation Sector Count  100 100 0000000000-0000 050

 007 Seek Error Rate  100 100 0000000000-0000 050

 008 Seek time Perfomance  100 100 0000000000-0000 050

 009 Power-On Hours Count  076 076 0000000000-25A8 000

 010 Spin Retry Count  204 100 0000000000-0000 030

 012 Device Power Cycle Count  100 100 0000000000-14D5 000

 191 G-sense Rate/Servo tracking  100 100 0000000000-0046 000

 192 Emergency Retract Count  100 100 0000000000-004F 000

 193 Load/unload Cycle Count  082 082 0000000002-D71C 000

 194 HDA Temperature  100 100 30 C  000

 194 HDA Temperature Maximum 100 100 53 C 000

 194 HDA Temperature Minimum 100 100 11 C 000

 196 Reallocation Event Count  100 100 0000000000-0000 000

 197 Current Pending Errors Count  100 100 0000000000-0000 000

 198 Uncorrectable Errors Count  100 100 0000000000-0000 000

 199 UltraDMA CRC Errors  200 200 0000000000-0000 000

 220 Disk Shift  100 100 0000000000-0036 000

 222 Loaded Hours  082 082 0000000000-1D46 000

 223 Load Retry Count  100 100 0000000000-0000 000

 224 Load Friction  100 100 0000000000-0000 000

 226 Load-in Time  100 100 0000000000-0146 000

 240 Heads Flying Hours  100 100 0000000000-0000 001


Offline Xas1953NC

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #15 on: January 28, 2015, 04:03:11 pm »
Hello Boggin, I downloaded the prog and unzipped and clicked on HDDScan exe but nothing happened.

Offline Boggin

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #16 on: January 28, 2015, 04:09:14 pm »
I already have it in my Downloads folder and after opening the folder, just double click on the HDDScan - Application - but will dump what I have and then download it again to refresh my memory.

I'm back.

Right - clicked on the Download button and selected Save

Closed the web site and view Downloads box then went to my Downloads folder - clicked on the .zip - Open - clicked on HDDScan 3.3 - Extract.

Clicked on HDDScan File Folder - Open - then double clicked on HDDScan for Type Application (7th one down the list) then follow the prompts.

Click on the black S.M.A.R.T. button to produce its analysis similar to mine.
« Last Edit: January 28, 2015, 04:22:56 pm by Boggin »

Offline Xas1953NC

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #17 on: January 28, 2015, 04:33:19 pm »
That is what I did but no joy. I did notice Avast icon rotate a few times but no resulting reason.

Offline Boggin

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #18 on: January 28, 2015, 04:38:04 pm »
Try it in Safe Mode with Networking - Avast may not like it.

When I downloaded that program that Shane had linked, my Norton 360 didn't like that and popped up a window advising me to remove it but also with the choice to run it anyway - similar to what Windows Smart Screen Filter does sometimes.

Offline Xas1953NC

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #19 on: January 28, 2015, 04:47:31 pm »
Ok, Boggin, thanks for your help. I'm signing off now as have to be up early tomorrow. Thanks

Offline Xas1953NC

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #20 on: January 29, 2015, 05:13:18 am »
Hello Boggin, the prog worked ok after a reboot. That was last night. I turned on the computer this morning and it went into start normally or Repair. I chose repair and restore. It booted up ok then but was was deleted was the exe of HDDScan and the exe of the prog Shane put a link to, WDdiag. They were both in the Download folder. I moved them to my external HDD Master Storage folder and unzipped them again so both are working. Whereas last night I had to reboot to get your one working, today it ran without a reboot. I have also managed to screen grab the results of both so will prepare them for Shane to have a look. Thanks

Offline Xas1953NC

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #21 on: January 29, 2015, 10:33:35 am »
Although I have tried various computations in endeavoring to get the computer to start I have only shown here the most recent attempt and the results. 27-01-2015: Computer finally started at 11.45am. Computer running ok. 29-01-2015: powered down at 12.50am taking 2m.40s to do so. Powered up again without a hitch at 12.54am. This took 4m.50s. Final powered down at 2.11am.
29-01-2015: 1st. startup of the day at 8.54 am. After 9m.30s computer closed itself down without a sign of power on led or drive led. The only thing that does light up are the leds behind the Acer Aspire tower nameplate. At 9.05am I turned computer on. After 5m.30s power led lights up and Acer screen appeared on monitor and then screen goes black (this is the normal prelude to booting up to show the progress bar but on the first startup of the day it does not happen)and the Acer screen appeared again followed by the choice to start a repair or start normally. I chose Repair followed by Restore. Computer then boots up successfully. The computer startup procedure does not always follow the same pattern. This is the first time for quite a while that I have let the computer run from start without my interaction to turn it off if nothing happens for 6 min, turn on again, turn off again and so on with stopwatched increments. Sometimes it can take from first startup plus my interactions to finally bootup something in like 40 or so minutes so this latest effort took took less time! I found a website that has a collection of sounds made by hdds on their way out but none appertained to my problem. I wonder if there is a failure of sorts that energising capacitors within the circuitry do not hold a charge initially to kickstart the computer up and that turning off and on by the power button builds up a charge where it will bootup. Here is the resulting srtTrail.log showing the Repair operation. Also enclosed are the hdd scans that you asked for, Shane. Thanks.

Startup Repair diagnosis and repair log
---------------------------
Last successful boot time: 1/29/2015 12:56:11 AM (GMT)
Number of repair attempts: 1

Session details
---------------------------
System Disk = \Device\Harddisk0
Windows directory = C:\Windows
AutoChk Run = 0
Number of root causes = 1

Test Performed:
---------------------------
Name: Check for updates
Result: Completed successfully. Error code =  0x0
Time taken = 15 ms

Test Performed:
---------------------------
Name: System disk test
Result: Completed successfully. Error code =  0x0
Time taken = 0 ms

Test Performed:
---------------------------
Name: Disk failure diagnosis
Result: Completed successfully. Error code =  0x0
Time taken = 94 ms

Test Performed:
---------------------------
Name: Disk metadata test
Result: Completed successfully. Error code =  0x0
Time taken = 31 ms

Test Performed:
---------------------------
Name: Target OS test
Result: Completed successfully. Error code =  0x0
Time taken = 94 ms

Test Performed:
---------------------------
Name: Volume content check
Result: Completed successfully. Error code =  0x0
Time taken = 2059 ms

Test Performed:
---------------------------
Name: Boot manager diagnosis
Result: Completed successfully. Error code =  0x0
Time taken = 0 ms

Test Performed:
---------------------------
Name: System boot log diagnosis
Result: Completed successfully. Error code =  0x0
Time taken = 0 ms

Test Performed:
---------------------------
Name: Event log diagnosis
Result: Completed successfully. Error code =  0x0
Time taken = 172 ms

Test Performed:
---------------------------
Name: Internal state check
Result: Completed successfully. Error code =  0x0
Time taken = 15 ms

Test Performed:
---------------------------
Name: Boot status test
Result: Completed successfully. Error code =  0x0
Time taken = 16 ms

Test Performed:
---------------------------
Name: Setup state check
Result: Completed successfully. Error code =  0x0
Time taken = 1248 ms

Test Performed:
---------------------------
Name: Registry hives test
Result: Completed successfully. Error code =  0x0
Time taken = 3135 ms

Test Performed:
---------------------------
Name: Windows boot log diagnosis
Result: Completed successfully. Error code =  0x0
Time taken = 0 ms

Test Performed:
---------------------------
Name: Bugcheck analysis
Result: Completed successfully. Error code =  0x0
Time taken = 1576 ms

Test Performed:
---------------------------
Name: Access control test
Result: Completed successfully. Error code =  0x0
Time taken = 20093 ms

Test Performed:
---------------------------
Name: File system test (chkdsk)
Result: Completed successfully. Error code =  0x0
Time taken = 0 ms

Test Performed:
---------------------------
Name: Software installation log diagnosis
Result: Completed successfully. Error code =  0x0
Time taken = 0 ms

Test Performed:
---------------------------
Name: Fallback diagnosis
Result: Completed successfully. Error code =  0x0
Time taken = 0 ms

Root cause found:
---------------------------
Unspecified changes to system configuration might have caused the problem.

Repair action: System Restore
Result: Completed successfully. Error code =  0x0
Time taken = 72057 ms

---------------------------
---------------------------
 

Offline Shane

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #22 on: January 30, 2015, 04:54:15 pm »
Thanks for the screen shots.

Ok so if I read your post correctly, there is times where it is almost 6 mins before you even see the Windows loading screen correct? Then you said it reboots and asks to do a repair, that means it blue screened on you and is set to auto reboot. You need to disable the auto reboot to see what the blue screen says, you can also use the WhoCrashed program to have it check and see what is most likly the cause of the blue screen.

http://www.resplendence.com/download/whocrashedSetup.exe

Let me know what the whocrashed report says.

I do have a computer in my house that after it has been off for a while I go to turn it on and it is a black screen and windows never boots, I hit the reset key on the tower (I dont turn it off) and it starts up like normal, Windows asks me if I want to repair I say no.

For this system I traced it to the video card. It is my old video card and it has done this at random times ever since I bought it 2 years ago. They tried to blame the power supply but it wasnt it. It is just the card it self needed a few more sec to fully power itself up before the motherboard goes on, so when i do the reset everything is fine, I can play any game and I have no crashes. This only happens on a fresh turn on of the tower.

So it is possible that it is hardware problem for you, but it may not be the hard drive for sure. Lets see what is causing those blue screens and go from there. :wink:

Shane

Offline Xas1953NC

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #23 on: January 31, 2015, 08:06:08 am »
Hello Shane, no, it not a 6 min issue but there are variables that occur even if I stick to a pattern of turning on and off the computer endeavoring to get it to start up. For example:

29-01-2015. 1st. startup of the day at 8.45 am. After 9m.30s computer turned itself off. I turned it on again approx. 4min later.
After 5m.30s Power led came on and Acer logo appeared on monitor. 30s later choice of Repair or Start Normally screen appeared.
I chose Repair followed by Restore. Result was booted up ok.

30-01-2015. Computer soft shutdown at 1.37am which took 3m to do so. No problems during this long ontime.

31-01-2015. 1st. startup of the day at 1.13.pm. After 11m.30s computer turned itself off. I turned it on again approx. 2min later.
After 30.m nothing happening so I turned off computer and turned it back on again after 2 min.
30s later power led and Acer logo appeared on monitor.
2m.5s later "Preparing Desktop" appeared followed by booting up ok.
This time there was no choice screen to Repair or Start Normally.
Computer does not have a reset button so I have to use the power off button.

I ran the Whocrashed prog which said there were no minidumps. I also have Nirsoft's BlueScreenView prog and it has never found any problems during the period of time these startup problems have appeared.

Although I waited 30m on this last attempt the computer may have possibly booted up in less time If I had turned it off sooner as it has done so in previous sessions where I have turned it off if nothing happens after 6 min. and then turned it on again and so on.
There have been previous sessions where I have ignored Repair and chosen Start Normally. Sometimes the bootup has been succesful and other times the bootup has resulted in the System Network icon in the taskbar having a cross on it, this in tandem with only 5 of the 9 icons that are normally shown. Because of this I have had to reboot again which results in a successful bootup taking approx. 10min.

I tend to clear Event Perfomance logs prior to finally shutting down computer and check what logs have been made on the 1st. startup of the day at the next session. Thanks
 

Offline Boggin

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Re: Vista Startup problems
« Reply #24 on: January 31, 2015, 09:36:14 am »
It's obviously having problems loading some drivers.

It could be worth going to your computer support site and downloading the Chipset drivers (Video drivers if AMD), but also check for a BIOS update.

You could create a Boot Log and copy & paste that.

You can do this by going Start - type msconfig and press enter.

Under the Boot tab check the radio button for Boot log and if you want to see the boot process, also check the one for OS boot information - Apply - OK - Restart.

With OS boot info checked, you should be able to see where it's sticking.

You can view the report in Windows\ntbtlog

Double click on ntbtlog and it will open in Notepad.

You will need to go back into msconfig to uncheck those items for it to boot "normally".
« Last Edit: January 31, 2015, 09:44:56 am by Boggin »